"Open Community"

Friday, September 16. 2005

This blog is dedicated to all the users out there that think features, functionality and options should be implemented because they say so. To the rest of you, we all love you.

<rant>

Lately I’ve been subject to a number of users making requests which I don’t think are necessary. I’m sure anybody developer that reads this can say the same. Unfortunately, what’s really grinding my gears is when users believe they are the epitome of correctness.

Don’t get me wrong, I love, encourage & and enthused by user feedback and ideas, but using an application is not like eating at a restaurant.

Most of us work for free on projects. Some people are luckier and are able to support themselves from such activities.

Quoting wikipedia:

The open source movement is a large movement of programmers and other computer users that advocates unrestricted access to the source code of software.

What’s this got to do with anything? Well I’m fed up of users telling us what to do. You must implement this, because it will “<insert reasoning here>”. Unfortunately for you, developers get the final say on what goes into an application.

I implore you, please, don’t abuse the developers who try their best to give time and energy to improving the software world. If you don’t like an answer, either try and provide better information to convince us or piss off.

</rant>

Thanks for listening - but remember folks, its just those few people out there that irritate me!

Posted by Seb Ruiz in sebr at 04:26 | Comments (11) | Trackbacks (0)

Trackbacks

Trackback specific URI for this entry

No Trackbacks

Comments

Display comments as (Linear | Threaded)

Well, as a user, I agree with Seb.

However, sometimes the reactions of the devs on the board are pretty stupid, too.

Life is like unto a canyon that echoes back to you...

So I'm not surprised when it ends up like this!

#1 fish (Homepage) on 2005-09-16 08:28 (Reply)

Yes, I agree that sometimes developers are misunderstood and sometimes behave with a lack of respect.

We should all work together to rectify this.

#1.1 sebr (Homepage) on 2005-09-16 08:30 (Reply)

Well, I can understand the developers because what you are describing above must be very annoying and tiring...

And it's just something I noticed in some threads and not a general thing. There's better ways of saying

"this is a stupid idea anyways"
"there are enough options already"
"just use juk if you want this feature"

I'm not saying that you are wrong with your blog entry, actually I think the statements of the developers usually make sense and are polite, it's just that sometimes you could express things a bit differently maybe!

#1.1.1 fish (Homepage) on 2005-09-16 08:49 (Reply)

(when I say "you" I mean all the devs and not sebr alone)

#1.1.1.1 fish (Homepage) on 2005-09-16 08:52 (Reply)

Problem with the answer "just use JuK if you want this feature" is that it's a very valid answer

It comes from the basic difference between the two players: JuK is a collection centric music player, where you can make playlists from that collection. amaroK is a playlists centric music player that has a collection. This makes some features unsuitable for amaroK, while they would fit JuK perfectly, and of course the other way around

This is essentially also why there is room for both amaroK and JuK - the two players work differently

#1.1.1.2 Dan Leinir Turthra Jensen (Homepage) on 2005-09-16 08:58 (Reply)

Well, just as a point of reference, I was talking to a guy on irc the other night who was describing how he wanted amaroK to work. What he was describing was exactly how juK works NOW! So, in this case, I think it was correct to point him in the direction of using juK because what he was asking for was fundamentally conflicting with the design of amaroK, while juK had that functionality already.

His response, "I don't want to use juK, I want to use amaroK"

So, how do you respond to this? An application exists that does what he wants, but rather than use it, he wants to convince the amaroK devs to rewrite most of their program so he can use it.

I think this is the kind of user that sebr is talking about, the ones that don't respond to reasoning and insist that you are there to serve them regardless of whether the item being discussed makes sense.

#1.1.1.3 oggb4mp3 on 2005-09-16 09:01 (Reply)

Yes I agree. The only time I get actually annoyed by a user trying to push a suggestion is when they start acting like "developer resources" is a number in a RTS game that can be delibarately distributed between various projects. "You've been working a lot on that, do this instead." (In reality of course what gets developed depends on expertise of individual developers and their interest.)

Luckily that doesn't happen too often.

#2 Ian Monroe on 2005-09-16 19:14 (Reply)

I think it all boils down to motivation. I think if a user really wants a feature that much, they will get motivated to scratch there own itch. If this isn't the case then don't feel bad about not being motivated to do it for them.

I'm not saying never consider anymore suggestion and leave users on there own. Just do what you like to do and have fun with it. I've been following the development of this project for long enough to know it has energetic development because everyone does what they like to do and not get bothered by a few trolling types.

So do what motivates you, not just what someone would like you to do.

#3 madpenguin8 on 2005-09-16 19:48 (Reply)

sebr, i can totally understand what you're saying and i experienced the very same feelings quite a few times since i hack on amarok (or in general actually).

still, i'd like to ask everyone to keep a friendly tone and communicate in a friendly way with our users. they are part of the amarok project just as we are. feel encouraged to tell your opinion and say frankly what you're thinking, but don't treat users as a plague. in the end it's always up to us whether we implement a feature or not. and often users proved to be a good source of inspiration, so we'd rather not piss them off just because we had a bad day.

keep on hacking,
muesli

#4 muesli (Homepage) on 2005-09-19 19:23 (Reply)

at the end, every open source project is a monarchic orientated structure, not a democratic one. some are democratic, but only between the gilde of the devs.

so the point of friendliness is not that much important as it seems to be. the project leaders have the right to be as much egocentric as they want to be. only in the aspect of commitment it's advisable to be friendly to the users. if you're consequently rude to the users, they will stop to support the project.

some people are confused by the open source concept as "i can wish what i want and it will be realized". they missunderstand the concept.

open source is there to modify. so if a user wants an exclusive feature, they should implement it on their own. and they should respect if project devs consider the feature unusuable for the mainstream branch.

so just show the "stinkefinger" to those wishlist fillers..

#5 indy (Homepage) on 2005-09-20 14:44 (Reply)

I'm sure it's frustrating, but I'd just like to say that I'm sure there are a great, great number of people out there who loveee amaroK. I've been using Linux for a month, and I told my friends that amaroK alone justifies the switch. It's better than iTunes, Winamp, Windows Media Player, foobar2000, or Rhythmbox.

Seriously, it's like somebody read my mind in what I wanted from music software. The only thing I might change would be to add a link to AllMusic like the Wikipedia link, but I know jack crap about programming, so I'm just glad you guys do!

#6 Keith Daniels (Homepage) on 2005-09-23 17:11 (Reply)

Add Comment

Name
Email
Homepage
In reply to
Comment	Enclosing asterisks marks text as bold (word), underscore are made via _word_. Standard emoticons like :-) and ;-) are converted to images. To prevent automated Bots from commentspamming, please enter the string you see in the image below in the appropriate input box. Your comment will only be submitted if the strings match. Please ensure that your browser supports and accepts cookies, or your comment cannot be verified correctly. Enter the string from the spam-prevention image above:
	Remember Information? Subscribe to this entry